Another question is, if no one involved with this situation first-hand wishes to persue the matter (Eric, FKNMS, Reef Savers), why is it any of our business?
Location: Mt. Vernon, Ohio - Hey they have a LFS with SW Fish
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I agree with alot of what people said from both sides.
My main question is
If EB has gotten in trouble with NOAA, and the problem not entirely, why are they working with him again?
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This little fiasco keeps reminding me of the Duke Lacrosse case. Turns out they didn't do anything wrong. Just like that case, I'm willing to bet that those who shouted out against them don't have the testicular fortitude to come forth and offer any sort of apology.
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They may be working with him because he is the only one willing to take the chance. They may be working with him because he has made amends in their minds.
Steven it is our business for two reasons. 1. He represents the reef community and if he messes up, the community should be talking about it. 2. Even if he does not represent the community, what happend can have the repercussions I previously stated. I don't want anything "repressed" or swept under the rug even if it is someone who is a "Brother" or a writer that I appreciate.
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If I were a Lacroose player, I would be screaming that my fellow Lacrosse players should not have been around a bunch of strippers/hookers at a team party. Ok they did not rape the woman of ill repute. They did have a large team party and invited them to come. That party would give Lacrosse a black eye - oh wait - it did.
If you represent me or my hobby - I will hold you to a standard even 2 years later.
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They may be working with him because he is the only one willing to take the chance. They may be working with him because he has made amends in their minds.
Steven it is our business for two reasons. 1. He represents the reef community and if he messes up, the community should be talking about it. 2. Even if he does not represent the community, what happend can have the repercussions I previously stated. I don't want anything "repressed" or swept under the rug even if it is someone who is a "Brother" or a writer that I appreciate.
See now, this is exactly why I have a problem with this whole "thing" being presented as it is.
"if he messes up, we should be talking about it", The thing is, is that it is being talked about without any proof that he did mess up. Just such statements leads one to assume a wrong doing, as does "repressed" or swept under the rug. What was repressed? Come on now, there is just nothing available to any one of us that could allow us to discuss Eric in any manner, not without adding a ton of assumptions. Which is just plain wrong, and not fair.
They may be working with him because he is the only one willing to take the chance. They may be working with him because he has made amends in their minds.
Or maybe they didn't know about the whole thing until the information was made public.
Keep in mind that when I initially made a few phone calls about this, I was told probably three times that Mr. Borneman's parents had threatened litigation in an effort to keep all this quiet. I suppose this could just be a rumor... but personally, considering the sources (and considering how many times and circumstances under which Mr. Borneman has jumped to threaten to sue web forums and individuals alike for "defamation")... I could believe it to be true.
Eric allegedly stated that there would be repercussions. Sounds repressed but that just may be his way of speaking.
Discussing the situation is "not fair?" I think you mean nothing available other than the letters originally cited are not fair. I can be mistaken though. I can route you to people who have heard EB demean others but that is pointless. We can discuss Eric, myself, Patrick or anyone else. There is nothing unfair about asking questions and discussing what the situation appears to be. I think threatened repercussions (as EB allegedly stated) with no explanation to your peeps is a tad unfair too. This is not the ReefGang where our little gang bang leaders are above reproach. I would like EB to answer my questions as well as those of others here because he is a leading representative in the reef keeping community. There is no law compelling him to speak. It will only cost a little respect but that doesn't have much value to many people anymore. Yes I made an assumtion that many people don't care about respect based on personal experiences. It does matter to me though. Our leaders are held to a moral/ethical standard that they may not be able to reach. For that I am sorry. BUT if you cannot lead, I will not follow you and I will talk about what I have read and seen.
Ok - you cannot argue the next statement:
Eric is believed, whether rightly or wrongly, that he did something wrong 2 years ago by an unspecified number of reefkeepers. This belief is based on documentation located at another site and is allegedly able to be confirmed by various governmental agencies. Eric is a leading representative of the reef keeping community. Eric has yet, to anyone's knowlege, explained the misunderstanding between himself, the government, or those who are rightly or wrongly concerned. Because he is a leader of the reef keeping community, some of those who he represents are discussing ad infinitum what has happened on a reef releted message board forum.
No assumptions there. I cannot stop people from making assumptions. Those who make wild assumptions are not given much credence. Those who back up beliefs with documentation generally are. I can only answer to the integrity of what I have said and I stand by what I have asked and said.
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